Talk:Air-formed domes - Revision history

Rasmus at 15:36, 4 March 2011

2011-03-04T15:36:56Z

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	:::::#[[Stucco sprayer]]		:::::#[[Stucco sprayer]]
	:::::#Foam insulation		:::::#Foam insulation

			:::::: Yes, and I might add: stucco sprayer is not a technical problem (compressed air + OS sprayer and we're set). Insulation does not have to be by foam, can be more eco-friendly biological materials. In Monolithic's version of the technology, the airform has two functions: 1.) form during construction and 2.) to keep out water.
			:::::: And a more general comment is that an alternative to poured concrete domes exists in [[CEB_Vaults\|domes from CEB tiles]], which avoid steel and airform, is much better in terms of carbon emissions and (likely) cost, but is more labor intensive.--[[User:Rasmus\|Rasmus]] 07:36, 4 March 2011 (PST)

Conor at 14:48, 4 March 2011

2011-03-04T14:48:03Z

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	::::This is true when they are built by [http://www.monolithic.com/ Monolithic]. MDI typically makes a custom airform which later stays with the dome on a permanent basis, to protect it from rain. This obviously adds greatly to the cost. Also, customers building such a dome often have their own very specific ideas about the desired shape and features of the dome. If it were more standardized, this type of thin-shell concrete should be far '''less''' expensive than ''post-and-beam'' construction. One big obstacle in the past has been that certain industries hate concrete domes (construction/cement industry because domes last forever and oil industry because they are so energy efficient). --[[User:Rasmus\|Rasmus]] 14:02, 27 February 2011 (PST)		::::This is true when they are built by [http://www.monolithic.com/ Monolithic]. MDI typically makes a custom airform which later stays with the dome on a permanent basis, to protect it from rain. This obviously adds greatly to the cost. Also, customers building such a dome often have their own very specific ideas about the desired shape and features of the dome. If it were more standardized, this type of thin-shell concrete should be far '''less''' expensive than ''post-and-beam'' construction. One big obstacle in the past has been that certain industries hate concrete domes (construction/cement industry because domes last forever and oil industry because they are so energy efficient). --[[User:Rasmus\|Rasmus]] 14:02, 27 February 2011 (PST)

			:::::I'd thought the airforms were made from plastic, but it says [http://www.monolithic.com/topics/airforms here] they're actually waterproof fabric: PVC-coated nylon or polyester. So the technology comes down to
			:::::#How to make a fabric airform of the desired shape.
			:::::#[[Stucco sprayer]]
			:::::#Foam insulation

Rasmus at 22:02, 27 February 2011

2011-02-27T22:02:42Z

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	:::The conventional wisdom on monolithic dome websites and forums is that they cost the same or a little more than conventional houses, and you make the money back in heating and repair costs. Examples: [http://www.monolithic.com/stories/the-true-cost-of-a-dome-home][http://bbs.monolithic.com/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=2063][http://www.essortment.com/whats-cost-associated-building-monolithic-dome-12549.html]. Frankly, I think this is determined more by business reasons than technological ones. They could be very, very cheap if open-sourced.--[[User:Conor\|Conor]] 07:57, 27 February 2011 (PST)		:::The conventional wisdom on monolithic dome websites and forums is that they cost the same or a little more than conventional houses, and you make the money back in heating and repair costs. Examples: [http://www.monolithic.com/stories/the-true-cost-of-a-dome-home][http://bbs.monolithic.com/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=2063][http://www.essortment.com/whats-cost-associated-building-monolithic-dome-12549.html]. Frankly, I think this is determined more by business reasons than technological ones. They could be very, very cheap if open-sourced.--[[User:Conor\|Conor]] 07:57, 27 February 2011 (PST)

			::::This is true when they are built by [http://www.monolithic.com/ Monolithic]. MDI typically makes a custom airform which later stays with the dome on a permanent basis, to protect it from rain. This obviously adds greatly to the cost. Also, customers building such a dome often have their own very specific ideas about the desired shape and features of the dome. If it were more standardized, this type of thin-shell concrete should be far '''less''' expensive than ''post-and-beam'' construction. One big obstacle in the past has been that certain industries hate concrete domes (construction/cement industry because domes last forever and oil industry because they are so energy efficient). --[[User:Rasmus\|Rasmus]] 14:02, 27 February 2011 (PST)

Conor at 15:57, 27 February 2011

2011-02-27T15:57:55Z

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	::I just saw the Youtube link you posted on the page [[Air-formed_domes]]. The Binishell appears to require not only two membranes (a major cost item, even when reusable) but also a particular kind of steel spring. --Rasmus		::I just saw the Youtube link you posted on the page [[Air-formed_domes]]. The Binishell appears to require not only two membranes (a major cost item, even when reusable) but also a particular kind of steel spring. --Rasmus

			:::The conventional wisdom on monolithic dome websites and forums is that they cost the same or a little more than conventional houses, and you make the money back in heating and repair costs. Examples: [http://www.monolithic.com/stories/the-true-cost-of-a-dome-home][http://bbs.monolithic.com/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=2063][http://www.essortment.com/whats-cost-associated-building-monolithic-dome-12549.html]. Frankly, I think this is determined more by business reasons than technological ones. They could be very, very cheap if open-sourced.--[[User:Conor\|Conor]] 07:57, 27 February 2011 (PST)

Rasmus at 14:45, 27 February 2011

2011-02-27T14:45:05Z

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	::Doesn't make obvious sense. Monolithic has brought down the cost of the ecoshell to bare bones materials cost. And now with [[basalt fibers]] one of the significant cost items (steel rebar) is eliminated. The inflatable form can be reused 100 times in both concepts. --Rasmus		::Doesn't make obvious sense. Monolithic has brought down the cost of the ecoshell to bare bones materials cost. And now with [[basalt fibers]] one of the significant cost items (steel rebar) is eliminated. The inflatable form can be reused 100 times in both concepts. --Rasmus

	::~~Conor,~~ I just saw the Youtube link you posted on the page [[Air-formed_domes]]. The Binishell appears to require not only two membranes (a major cost item, even when reusable) but also a particular kind of steel spring.		::I just saw the Youtube link you posted on the page [[Air-formed_domes]]. The Binishell appears to require not only two membranes (a major cost item, even when reusable) but also a particular kind of steel spring. --Rasmus

Rasmus at 14:44, 27 February 2011

2011-02-27T14:44:19Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 14:44, 27 February 2011
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	::Doesn't make obvious sense. Monolithic has brought down the cost of the ecoshell to bare bones materials cost. And now with [[basalt fibers]] one of the significant cost items (steel rebar) is eliminated. The inflatable form can be reused 100 times in both concepts. --Rasmus		::Doesn't make obvious sense. Monolithic has brought down the cost of the ecoshell to bare bones materials cost. And now with [[basalt fibers]] one of the significant cost items (steel rebar) is eliminated. The inflatable form can be reused 100 times in both concepts. --Rasmus

			::Conor, I just saw the Youtube link you posted on the page [[Air-formed_domes]]. The Binishell appears to require not only two membranes (a major cost item, even when reusable) but also a particular kind of steel spring.

Rasmus at 14:31, 27 February 2011

2011-02-27T14:31:29Z

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	:Binishells seem much cheaper. I have no idea why. --[[User:Conor\|Conor]] 13:44, 26 February 2011 (PST)		:Binishells seem much cheaper. I have no idea why. --[[User:Conor\|Conor]] 13:44, 26 February 2011 (PST)

			::Doesn't make obvious sense. Monolithic has brought down the cost of the ecoshell to bare bones materials cost. And now with [[basalt fibers]] one of the significant cost items (steel rebar) is eliminated. The inflatable form can be reused 100 times in both concepts. --Rasmus

Conor at 21:44, 26 February 2011

2011-02-26T21:44:02Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 21:44, 26 February 2011
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	monolithic= inflate, then "shotcrete"		monolithic= inflate, then "shotcrete"
	--Rasmus		--Rasmus

			:Binishells seem much cheaper. I have no idea why. --[[User:Conor\|Conor]] 13:44, 26 February 2011 (PST)

Rasmus: Created page with "Closely related page: http://openfarmtech.org/wiki/Monolithic_Dome, perhaps we can merge them. Basic difference: binishells= concrete first, then inflate monolithic= inflate, th..."

2011-02-26T20:21:51Z

Created page with "Closely related page: http://openfarmtech.org/wiki/Monolithic_Dome, perhaps we can merge them. Basic difference: binishells= concrete first, then inflate monolithic= inflate, th..."

New page

Closely related page: http://openfarmtech.org/wiki/Monolithic_Dome, perhaps we can merge them. Basic difference:
binishells= concrete first, then inflate
monolithic= inflate, then "shotcrete"
--Rasmus