Engines: Difference between revisions
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==Gas== | ==Gas== | ||
*{{check}}Aliexpress US ship - $ | Note: at $15-20/hp - if the engine is considered 'disposable', it is actaully a good choice. Old copies can be used for parts, as long as the same engine is used. If there are different engines with different parts, maintenance is onerous. | ||
*{{check}}{{check}}$225 for 15 hp. Aliexpress US ship - $15/hp. [https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256809598544762.html] | |||
'''The threshold for relatively inexpensive engines is 19 hp.''' | '''The threshold for relatively inexpensive engines is 19 hp.''' | ||
*27 hp - $980 - $36/hp - [https://www.amazon.com/Briggs-Stratton-49T877-0004-G1-Commercial-Cyclonic/dp/B00IUAYGVG/ref=asc_df_B00IUAYGVG/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=167118301188&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=13505321821607907613&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9023315&hvtargid=pla-506378404232&psc=1]. And needs muffler. | *27 hp - $980 - $36/hp - [https://www.amazon.com/Briggs-Stratton-49T877-0004-G1-Commercial-Cyclonic/dp/B00IUAYGVG/ref=asc_df_B00IUAYGVG/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=167118301188&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=13505321821607907613&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9023315&hvtargid=pla-506378404232&psc=1]. And needs muffler. | ||
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*7 hp - $159 - $22/hp - but no electric start - [https://www.harborfreight.com/65-HP-212cc-OHV-Horizontal-Shaft-Gas-Engine-EPACARB-69727.html?ccdenc=eyJjb2RlIjoiMjYwMDEyOTMiLCJza3UiOiI2OTcyNyIsImlzIjoiOTkuOTkiLCJwcm9kdWN0X2lk%0D%0AIjoiODgxNSJ9%0D%0A&cid=paid_google|*PLA+-+Top+SKUs+-+All+%28Branded%29|Shop+Press|69727&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=*PLA+-+Top+SKUs+-+All+%28Branded%29&utm_content=Shop+Press&gclid=CjwKCAjw_Y_8BRBiEiwA5MCBJmekp_1bVencitpDjdNbKuXfFBgJjMpvpitWg3gWQVOLRJN7aFkYfxoC450QAvD_BwE] | *7 hp - $159 - $22/hp - but no electric start - [https://www.harborfreight.com/65-HP-212cc-OHV-Horizontal-Shaft-Gas-Engine-EPACARB-69727.html?ccdenc=eyJjb2RlIjoiMjYwMDEyOTMiLCJza3UiOiI2OTcyNyIsImlzIjoiOTkuOTkiLCJwcm9kdWN0X2lk%0D%0AIjoiODgxNSJ9%0D%0A&cid=paid_google|*PLA+-+Top+SKUs+-+All+%28Branded%29|Shop+Press|69727&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=*PLA+-+Top+SKUs+-+All+%28Branded%29&utm_content=Shop+Press&gclid=CjwKCAjw_Y_8BRBiEiwA5MCBJmekp_1bVencitpDjdNbKuXfFBgJjMpvpitWg3gWQVOLRJN7aFkYfxoC450QAvD_BwE] | ||
*'''18hp Duromax $18/hp''' - has muffler, but not charging {{x}}- such as for a fan - [https://www.maxtool.com/products/duromax-xp18hp-440cc-18-hp-recoil-start-horizontal-gas-powered-engine?gclid=CjwKCAjwzMeFBhBwEiwAzwS8zIiE5wELYBs-whgO_x3sCukvav0_O4DbexejLwm-PdkdHPIqctL4ERoC4sQQAvD_BwE] | *'''18hp Duromax $18/hp''' - has muffler, but not charging {{x}}- such as for a fan - [https://www.maxtool.com/products/duromax-xp18hp-440cc-18-hp-recoil-start-horizontal-gas-powered-engine?gclid=CjwKCAjwzMeFBhBwEiwAzwS8zIiE5wELYBs-whgO_x3sCukvav0_O4DbexejLwm-PdkdHPIqctL4ERoC4sQQAvD_BwE] | ||
=1000CC EFI= | |||
*{{check}}$30/hp china so double it for real cost - [https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/L0cin-H1000-EFI-4-Stroke-Gasoline_1601438067203.html?spm=a2700.prosearch.normal_offer.d_title.162267afwmL09g&priceId=ed1c796de8a34b40b0eac3d0c9a25a66] | |||
=420 cc= | =420 cc= | ||
*$250 free ship [https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256808377112328.html?src=google&pdp_npi=4%40dis%21USD%21336.66%21192.30%21%21%21%21%21%40%2112000045736608384%21ppc%21%21%21&snps=y&src=google&albch=shopping&acnt=752-015-9270&isdl=y&slnk=&plac=&mtctp=&albbt=Google_7_shopping&aff_platform=google&aff_short_key=_oDc8nzq&gclsrc=aw.ds&albagn=888888&ds_e_adid=775771422608&ds_e_matchtype=search&ds_e_device=c&ds_e_network=g&ds_e_product_group_id=2441360045959&ds_e_product_id=en3256808377112328&ds_e_product_merchant_id=5551326180&ds_e_product_country=US&ds_e_product_language=en&ds_e_product_channel=online&ds_e_product_store_id=&ds_url_v=2&albcp=23046469188&albag=189807470550&isSmbAutoCall=false&needSmbHouyi=false&gad_source=1&gad_campaignid=23046469188&gbraid=0AAAAA_eFwRAfVedGYBS-FUOZ-naoiaH3s&gclid=Cj0KCQiA0p7KBhCkARIsAE6XlanX-RwRVHlJKpCuARViDhbfwGaBt8EPRbdO_oPUIz6_Kgto1Z0yakMaAhG1EALw_wcB&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa] | |||
*$300 [https://www.amazon.com/Engine-Stroke-Gasoline-Recoil-Splitter/dp/B07SS34FL6?source=ps-sl-shoppingads-lpcontext&ref_=fplfs&psc=1&smid=A1K701V6WP5WUK] | *$300 [https://www.amazon.com/Engine-Stroke-Gasoline-Recoil-Splitter/dp/B07SS34FL6?source=ps-sl-shoppingads-lpcontext&ref_=fplfs&psc=1&smid=A1K701V6WP5WUK] | ||
*$283 [https://www.walmart.com/ip/Gas-Engine-420CC-15-HP-4-Stroke-Gasoline-Motor-Engine-Recoil-Start-Go-Kart-Log-Splitter-Lifan-Type-Engine-OHV-Pull-Start-Garden-Tool-Gas-Motor/2472065482?wmlspartner=wlpa&selectedSellerId=101089463&adid=222222222282472065482_101089463_14069003552_202077872&wl0=&wl1=g&wl2=m&wl3=42423897272&wl4=pla-295289030566&wl5=9023282&wl6=&wl7=&wl8=&wl9=pla&wl10=484571015&wl11=online&wl12=2472065482_101089463&veh=sem&gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAiAqNSsBhAvEiwAn_tmxYkq9CuVjXhmOfrCIh62z250nQr79lEgVZD-W7WoiqUnZX-tt7Cr_hoC3FUQAvD_BwE] | *$283 [https://www.walmart.com/ip/Gas-Engine-420CC-15-HP-4-Stroke-Gasoline-Motor-Engine-Recoil-Start-Go-Kart-Log-Splitter-Lifan-Type-Engine-OHV-Pull-Start-Garden-Tool-Gas-Motor/2472065482?wmlspartner=wlpa&selectedSellerId=101089463&adid=222222222282472065482_101089463_14069003552_202077872&wl0=&wl1=g&wl2=m&wl3=42423897272&wl4=pla-295289030566&wl5=9023282&wl6=&wl7=&wl8=&wl9=pla&wl10=484571015&wl11=online&wl12=2472065482_101089463&veh=sem&gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAiAqNSsBhAvEiwAn_tmxYkq9CuVjXhmOfrCIh62z250nQr79lEgVZD-W7WoiqUnZX-tt7Cr_hoC3FUQAvD_BwE] | ||
*$260 [https://www.amazon.com/DONSU-4-Stroke-Cylinder-Keyed-Straight-Gasoline/dp/B07ZF55ZXY/ref=asc_df_B07ZF55ZXY/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=385169503131&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=11692132176509796224&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9023345&hvtargid=pla-837532324975&psc=1&mcid=eade5014d1d1381eb9fc9d25c3d1869b&tag=&ref=&adgrpid=78287725613&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvadid=385169503131&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=11692132176509796224&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9023345&hvtargid=pla-837532324975&gclid=Cj0KCQiAhomtBhDgARIsABcaYym1hCjCxZJJ6gxQLB7Ey8y4rnRwqnHiL7XOmyv8ZXzDBvPt02ZEUN0aAkeiEALw_wcB#customerReviews] | *$260 [https://www.amazon.com/DONSU-4-Stroke-Cylinder-Keyed-Straight-Gasoline/dp/B07ZF55ZXY/ref=asc_df_B07ZF55ZXY/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=385169503131&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=11692132176509796224&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9023345&hvtargid=pla-837532324975&psc=1&mcid=eade5014d1d1381eb9fc9d25c3d1869b&tag=&ref=&adgrpid=78287725613&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvadid=385169503131&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=11692132176509796224&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9023345&hvtargid=pla-837532324975&gclid=Cj0KCQiAhomtBhDgARIsABcaYym1hCjCxZJJ6gxQLB7Ey8y4rnRwqnHiL7XOmyv8ZXzDBvPt02ZEUN0aAkeiEALw_wcB#customerReviews] | ||
==Diesel | =35 hp= | ||
*$750 a pop from China [https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/Top-Quality-OHV-Twin-V-Cylinder_1601201778490.html?spm=a2700.details.popular_products.7.71ea5e70Oqm8dI] | |||
=Diesel= | |||
*30 hp Kubota $5000 - $166/hp [https://www.ebay.com/i/333616486882?chn=ps] | *30 hp Kubota $5000 - $166/hp [https://www.ebay.com/i/333616486882?chn=ps] | ||
*33 hp Kubota - $6500 [http://vi.raptor.ebaydesc.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemDescV4&item=303553207698&category=46098&pm=1&ds=0&t=1602096897000&ver=0] | *33 hp Kubota - $6500 [http://vi.raptor.ebaydesc.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemDescV4&item=303553207698&category=46098&pm=1&ds=0&t=1602096897000&ver=0] | ||
| Line 55: | Line 62: | ||
*300 hp [https://www.skoolielivin.com/caterpillar-cat-3116-3126-diesel-engine/] $7500 [https://usengineproduction.com/products/3126-CATERPILLAR-CAT-3126-3V-CKM-8YL-7AS-9SZ-BKD-DIESEL-LONG-BLOCK-ENGINE-/238#linktohere] | *300 hp [https://www.skoolielivin.com/caterpillar-cat-3116-3126-diesel-engine/] $7500 [https://usengineproduction.com/products/3126-CATERPILLAR-CAT-3126-3V-CKM-8YL-7AS-9SZ-BKD-DIESEL-LONG-BLOCK-ENGINE-/238#linktohere] | ||
=Considerations= | |||
*Until an open source engine becomes a reality, engine repair is expensive. $50/hr, easily comes to the new engine price for the $300 gas engine. This indicates that small engines are essentially disposable goods. | *Until an open source engine becomes a reality, engine repair is expensive. $50/hr, easily comes to the new engine price for the $300 gas engine. This indicates that small engines are essentially disposable goods. | ||
*For the large diesel engine, parts are expensive. | *For the large diesel engine, parts are expensive. | ||
Latest revision as of 21:29, 27 December 2025
About
- 2-strokes have 3-9 hp at 50 cc. See cc to hp - [1]
- Ex - Stihl MS 660 is 7 hp and 91 cc
- 1 hp for $25 for simple small engines.
- 1000 hp are $25k for the largest tractor in the world.
50 cc 2 stroke
- Only 1.3 hp? $50 about. [2]
Large
- JD 9 series engine, 14.l, 450 hp - around $30k [3]
50 cc with Electric Start
- $209 -[4]
3hp
- $40 - [5]
6.5 hp
- For the $/hp ratio, the 212 cc range appears slightly better than the 16 hp range. 420 cc for 2 - cheaper than any 440 cc.
Predator HF $150 212 cc - [6]. Performance review is solid [7]- GX160 clone Walmart $134 [8]. Elect. start $70 more [9]
- Walmart $144 7.5 hp 212 cc Electric Start [10]
- With electric start - 212 cc - $170 [11]
- Honda GX160 clone - $160 - 6.5 hp [12]
20 hp Range
Selection
OSE's 2020 choice for an engine is the Poulan 19 hp x4 for 74 hp - [13]
Gas
Note: at $15-20/hp - if the engine is considered 'disposable', it is actaully a good choice. Old copies can be used for parts, as long as the same engine is used. If there are different engines with different parts, maintenance is onerous.
- $225 for 15 hp. Aliexpress US ship - $15/hp. [14]
The threshold for relatively inexpensive engines is 19 hp.
- 27 hp - $980 - $36/hp - [15]. And needs muffler.
- 24 hp - $870 - $36/hp [16]
- 22 hp - Briggs - $29/hp - [17]
- 20 hp - Kohler $700 - $35/hp + muffler - [18]
- 16 hp - $350 - Poulan - [19]. No gas pump, gravity feed gas. But, doesn't come with muffler. Has 15A charging. Muffler - [20]
- 16hp - $370 - Duromax, $23/hp - [21]
- 7 hp - $159 - $22/hp - but no electric start - [22]
- 18hp Duromax $18/hp - has muffler, but not charging
- such as for a fan - [23]
1000CC EFI
- $30/hp china so double it for real cost - [24]
420 cc
35 hp
- $750 a pop from China [29]
Diesel
- 30 hp Kubota $5000 - $166/hp [30]
- 33 hp Kubota - $6500 [31]
- 65 HP - $6300 - $100/hp [32]
- 200 hp - $55/HP - $11k - Cummins - [33]
- 360 HP Mack used - $10/HP - $3600
- 300 hp [34] $7500 [35]
Considerations
- Until an open source engine becomes a reality, engine repair is expensive. $50/hr, easily comes to the new engine price for the $300 gas engine. This indicates that small engines are essentially disposable goods.
- For the large diesel engine, parts are expensive.
- Until the advent of the open source diesel engine, engine costs remain 10x as high as they should be.
- Until the OS engine, disposable engines are a suboptimal but acceptable strategy to keep costs of engine systems low.
- It is an immediate priority of OSE to develop open source small engines, $11B market (see Market Size) and larger ones are more like 200 billion
Engine Links
- 500 &U 1000 hour lifetime for small engines - [36]
- 2000-4000 year life of car engines [37] - 150k miles
- Tractor engines - 5-10k hours [38]
- Pellet-fired stirling engine buggy - see PDF file
- Several links to various engine types including Sterling, Wankel, Steam, etc. [39].
Types
Rotary